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Post by John Gray on May 12, 2006 7:06:10 GMT -5
Current threads in both the general and viewpoint sections - see “Last Minute Deals” (general) and “Last Minutes” (Viewpoint) – highlight what I, and others, see as a most unfortunate development. It seems that the forum boards, until now a place reserved for the free discussion of all matters relating to fly fishing, is to be used for commercial purposes.
We have always had advertising at the top of the forum. In addition to the adverts served up by Fish and Fly, it seems that the Google ads have now become a permanent feature. But we have grown used to them and they are easily ignored by those not interested in their content. They do not interfere with the business of the main forum, which has, until now, been reserved for the exclusive use of the members.
We now find that, between the “Fishing Partners” section and the “Classified” sections of the forum, a new section, poorly disguised as a legitimate section of the forum, has been inserted by our new moderator, Simon Lewin. The section, entitled “Last Minute Trips”, proposes to list “Details of late availability for fly fishing around the world”. Prospective advertisers of such fishing are advised to contact Simon Lewin to have their advert included in the section.
Others have pointed out that the forum already has a “Classified” section for the advertising of fishing related products and services. There is also a section on “Destination Fly Fishing” and one on “UK and Europe Rivers Updates”, any of which might be used to draw attention to fishing opportunities. Nevertheless, although it might be said that the forum is becoming increasingly fragmented by the addition of new categories, it would not be unreasonable to include a section where forum members might draw the attention of other members to fishing opportunities, last minute or otherwise.
However, to insert an advertising space in the midst of our forum is most misleading, some might say unethical. This new “section” is NOT a part of the forum. Members are not allowed to post on it or to reply to posts on it. It should not be there. It devalues this forum.
This forum has, over a number of years, built a well deserved reputation as a place where fly fishermen might exchange views, knowledge and opinion, free from administrative interference or commercial influence. This new development threatens that reputation. The administrators would be well advised to abandon this idea. If they do not, members, such as myself, will be less likely to participate in the forum.
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Post by newbie2006 on May 12, 2006 7:17:23 GMT -5
Totally agree John.
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Post by Cothi on May 12, 2006 7:20:50 GMT -5
I'm in complete agreement with John Gray and urge Invicta to close the new section and move the thread to Classified which is open to us all.
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Post by Sewinman on May 12, 2006 7:22:09 GMT -5
Totally agree.
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lynbuell
Junior Member
Float tubes make your boots last longer.
Posts: 73
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Post by lynbuell on May 12, 2006 7:33:54 GMT -5
yup im on board with removing the section.
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Post by newbie2006 on May 12, 2006 7:34:55 GMT -5
Actually, while we're at it - I'd also appreciate it if, when I post a thread asking about a specific product or bit of kit and how to use it.... I didn't then get private messages from people on the forum saying that I can buy such kit from them at a 'special price' etc.
I come to these boards for advice and for the banter and such-like, not for a sales pitch!!
Yours,
Grumpy.
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Post by G Ritchie on May 12, 2006 7:47:51 GMT -5
I really don't see the problem with the new section. Anyone can post on it, you just have to e-mail Simon with the details. My guess is that they have set it up this way to keep it uncluttered by the petty arguments which have become a feature of late. If you have no interest simply don't open any posts in that section but I am sure many people looking for last minute deals will find it useful and as such it can only enhance the forum.
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Post by iainabrach on May 12, 2006 7:50:48 GMT -5
That's a fair old website you have got going yourself John, of course I assume all free of charge and done out of pure altruism!
Iain
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Post by swifty on May 12, 2006 7:57:11 GMT -5
However, to insert an advertising space in the midst of our forum is most misleading, some might say unethical. This new “section” is NOT a part of the forum. Members are not allowed to post on it or to reply to posts on it. It should not be there. It devalues this forum. I completely agree with this. The new section blurs the line between content and advertising. Either open it to all or get rid of it. I cant see why it could not be accommodated under classifieds. Cheers, S |
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MJB
Full Member
Posts: 174
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Post by MJB on May 12, 2006 8:09:42 GMT -5
The new section blurs the line between content and advertising. That happened ages ago, when the world and his wife started touting their Kenyan tied, flexipopping, bloke stripping, under the counter tackle. I hadn't noticed this new section until everyone started making a fuss. |
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Post by joey1 on May 12, 2006 8:13:41 GMT -5
Let's not lose sight of the fact that we all use this forum free of charge, If Invicta and/or Simon find a way of making some funds as a result, I don't have a problem with that. Also, remember that the last minute deals forum is not forced on us. If we don't want to view it, we don't have to. I would encourage the forum owners to change the name of the forum to "Bargains" and to offer a slot to retailers too, so that the latest tackle bargains on offer can be viewed by all of us, in one place, with a minimum of surfing. Maybe we'd even get some special offers for forum members. Russ I agree that it would be an advantage to have all the PM bargains, back stratching and tackle deals out in the open and accessable in one 'commercial topic section. But isn't that point of Classifieds? Maybe it should be 'Commercial Classifieds? ... No problems with travel specials, and if promoting this section meens certain discounts for forum members... I don't think anyone can deny thay like a good bargain. The whole point is that Grouse would not be permitted to post his information in this new section, which is reserved for the exclusive use of Simon Lewin and his (presumably paying) advertisers. This is not a part of the forum. It is an advertising space, on which members are not permitted to post. This I find objectionable. No access to a Topic Section, on an open forum. If a forum member takes one of these bargains is it not good commercial practise to have the right to review the travel package when you get back? Consumers wan't to be informed on any travel package so if Forum members wish to endorse of critiisize a certain package deal through their own experience is this not the section to keep forum members informed with helpful feed back? Just coming up to stratch we have peter/invicta who is an administrator and Simon who is a moderator?  J. |
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Post by The Famous Grouse on May 12, 2006 8:35:55 GMT -5
I have often argued against the fragmentation of the forum by adding too many highly-specialized "micro forums". Every time the point has come up that we need this, that, or the other new forum, I've argued that the topic in question fits perfectly well within an existing category.
For example, the Casting Discussion. Why? 50 posts and 535 views in how many months? And how is any possible topic in that area not related to General Fly fishing?
Then there's the Coarse Fishing on the Fly and Destination Fly Fishing. Both with a paltry number of views and posts. Is it not time to cull at least 3 and possible 4 of these areas?
In the future, I'd suggest this rule for adding new areas. Add them for 3 months. If their number of views does not exceed that of the next least viewed area, cut them.
My reasoning was (and is) that too many micro-forums make it difficult to find information and the new member will have trouble knowing which of the 4 or 5 possible relevant choices he or she post in.
In honesty, I'd ask why not just post these last minute trips in the Classifieds and lock the thread?
If a more overt attention-getter is necessary, put a sticky on the top of the main board with a link, but only for a few days.
Grouse
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Post by John Gray on May 12, 2006 9:21:24 GMT -5
That's a fair old website you have got going yourself John, of course I assume all free of charge and done out of pure altruism! Iain I hope forum members will forgive me for responding to your irrelevant post but I felt obliged to thank you for your kind comments. I hope to improve the site by adding information about Scottish game fishing as and when possible. You are correct in your assumption that there is no charge for viewing the information on my website, less so in your assumption that the site was created out of altruism. |
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Post by Invicta on May 12, 2006 9:30:08 GMT -5
Some fair comments in this thread - I've taken these on board and the Last Minute Trip board is now within the classified area.
To clarify, yes - the last minute trip board is commercial nature but at the same time the intention is to give access to fishing that would otherwise be unavailable or would cost more than it does here. I've discussed the guidelines with Simon and unless the content fits into this category it won't be listed.
Cheers,
Invicta
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Post by Gingernick on May 12, 2006 9:30:49 GMT -5
The new section blurs the line between content and advertising. That happened ages ago, when the world and his wife started touting their Kenyan tied, flexipopping, bloke stripping, under the counter tackle. I hadn't noticed this new section until everyone started making a fuss. sums up me as well..I read the bits I want to read..if it doesnt interest me I dont click on it..I had not even noticed it was there |
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