thread colour choice

[beckster]

I've got a bloke XL50 blank which is burgundy,anyone recommend a nice contrasting thread colour?

[Silver Stoat]

Not too long ago I built a four piece on a Pacific Bay blank which is a deep rich plum/burgundy.
I used a bronze coloured thread (not a metallic though) which, when epoxied without colour preserver, darkened slightly and took on some of the blank colour.
To my eyes, this complimented the blank colour perfectly and produced a subtle, understated look. In the sunshine the bronze comes to life and gently glows through the finish.

If you are in doubt as to your final choice the best thing to do is make several short whippings, using the 'possible' different colours, on the part of the blank that will be covered by the handle/reel fitting. Apply epoxy and next day make your choice and then remove them while the epoxy is still soft. You can repeat this ad-infinitum until you have something that looks good.
You don't have to use nylon thread (although this is best) as polyester sewing threads will give you a fair idea of how your choices will look. Then choose the nearest colour nylon whipping thread to your final choice.

Dave.

[leisuredgentleman]

Turquoise? Canary yellow? Black? Purple?

[Robin]

And ,please,stop using bloody epoxy!
Robin

[Silver Stoat]

Nothing wrong with epoxy, Robin. It's tough, doesn't yellow so much as oil based varnish and it's certainly a quicker process to coat whippings with than it is with varnish.
I might agree that, unless used very sparingly, it can look bad on cane and multiple coats of a good quality tung oil/copal yacht varnish will usually give a better result on such a rod. I have, however, seen cane rods that have had the whippings coated with a carefully applied coat of epoxy which did look very good indeed.

I think it compliments a carbon fibre rod quite well but, as I have said before, modern rods can never look really good to my eyes no matter how much they might be embellished (tarted up) with over fancy whippings and shiny reel fittings. When your starting point is a tapered grey plastic tube from which every minor blemish has been ground out, then the best you can end up with is a characterless but sleek and efficient tool.

Dave.

[Robin]

I constantly mess about with different varnishes,Epiphanes is very good,you have to thin it with their thinner,and it is sold in unecessarily large units.
So Im back where I was about 35 years ago,with small tins of Humbrol model varnish.
It does not go yellow,there are rods here that I finished 30 years ago as evidence.
I think it is polyurethane based,so some cane rodmakers prefer a more amber look,I don't.
I don't mind the multi-coating,the result is worth it,and I still think it penetrates better than any epoxies,even thinned West System stuff,which is of impeccable quality.
Needless to say I apply it direct,no first coat of colour preserver or anything else,since it is easy to use it may not be all that much slower than epoxies,allowing for mixing time,and I can use a really good brush because it can be easily re-used.I had one brush for about a decade!
One last tip,when you have finished the rod,provided you are not immediately going to finish another,throw the tin away!
There comes a time in the life of any varnish when all the thinning in the world won't bring it back.
I'm not fond of the concept of speed when applied to rod finishing,if you are going to spend 30 or more years using the thing then another few days making it are neither here or there.
Robin
PS,a really good brush is one you hardly beleive the price of!

[Robin]

I apologise for not rising to your fly over carbon rods,but I'm really a rod designer more than a constructor.
Whilst I make cane rods I am therefore not blind to their limitations,and,when you hit them you need a different material,like carbon.
If this were the US dominated Rodmakers List I should now be howled at!
R

[Silver Stoat]

Robin,

I don't really understand your latest post if this was in response to mine.
My statement regarding carbon fibre rods was just that, a statement and nothing more.
I do believe that compared to the lovely organic feel and looks of a matured bamboo rod, a modern carbon rod can never look good - but it will be a much more efficient tool.

When I started rodbuilding in the late 1950s' there was little choice of material other than split bamboo, some greenhart and steel. The new fangled glass fibre material was still at the stage where attempting a fly rod using it would have been a waste of time, so I did have quite a bit of experience building with cane, but as soon as the reasonable quality tubular glass arrived I switched to that for all my rod building.
I can see no real advantage that cane has over carbon, other than looking beautiful, for anything above 7-7.5 ft. and (say) #4 weight lines. Longer than that and the rods are heavy and, with the inherently slow recovery speed of cane, tend to be sluggish. Of those available, I can think of no worse material for a 10 ft. #8 weight Seatrout or reservoir rod than cane.

I would disagree with your choice of varnish if, and only if, you were looking for the very best to coat your rods with, and also with your advice regarding brushes.
I would argue that a quality tung oil/copal varnish, the real stuff made by a traditional gum-running process, would be the best and that your fingers will outperform any brush for both speed and the ability to apply the very thin coats required.

Dave.

[Robin]

Your limit of &.5' and#4 is behind what is now feasible.
The limit is really set by the maximum stress levels that cane will tolerate.
This limits the use of fast tapers a bit!
I doubt that even the cutting edge guys like Bjarne fries would really enjoy trying to make a 10'#8 in cane,although some might argue that an 8'10'' #6,which can be made ,would suffice for many of its duties......................
R

[Robin]

I use my finger as well as the brush,you have to,or the bits between the rings can run.
tung and copal are natural products,as such they oxidise,which means alligatoring and darkening.Then there is the matter of the eternal drying cycle...............
I'm trying to pitch this at the beginners,SS has been rodfangling for as long as I have,if he likes using copal varnish nothing I say will stop him,he can cope with the problems.
What I do not like to see is someones first rod spoilt by being daubed with horrible treacly boat-goop.
AKA Epoxy!
R

[Silver Stoat]

Robin,

I can see what your aims are but I am very wary about recommending the use of polyurethane on cane rods.
Having worked in the laboratories of a major coatings company for a good chunk of my working life I'm aware of the advantages and disadvantages of the various varnishes. Polyurethane is easy to apply and will dry quickly under most conditions but, unless subsequent coats are applied within 24 - 48 hrs., inter-coat adhesion can be relatively poor without surface treatment (i.e. abrasive keying - tedious). This can lead to shivering and flaking in the long term caused by flexing.
I would still advise anyone to go for a good quality, non polyurethane based, yacht varnish. Providing reasonable care is taken in preparation and cleanliness, there should be no problems with drying.

Dave.

[Robin]

Never,ever ,had trouble with polyu. on polyu.,but you should not mix it with Tung/Copal.
one way round it works,the other it doesn't,forgotten which,and it can't work well,so don't do it!
R